I wouldn't recommend coming here at full price as it's absolutely not worth it. Instead of relaxing, you end up spending the entire day standing in endless lines. My husband and I waited 40 minutes at the bar, then 65 minutes for the zipline, and another 50 minutes for snorkeling. There was basically no enjoyment, just constant frustration. We didn't even get a chance to eat, even though it was included in the price. The café closed at 4:00 PM while the park itself stays open until 5:00 PM, which makes no sense. The pool was also very cloudy, like it hadn't been cleaned in weeks. We paid 1,000 pesos for two people since we live in Quintana Roo (about 500 pesos per person), and at that price it's somewhat acceptable. But if you're a tourist paying full price, it's honestly not worth it at all. And what really made the experience uncomfortable: while I was in the women's shower/changing area, a woman walked in with her son who looked around 12 years old, right at the moment when I was changing my underwear. When I pointed out that this was the women's area, she said, "He's just a child." That felt completely inappropriate and uncomfortable. It also doesn't seem like staff are enforcing basic rules about access to changing and shower areas. read more

Garrafón Park - Pool - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

They don't. take. credit. cards. So bring at least $1500 pesos for snorkeling. They might also cover some food. Better to just bring $2000 to $3000 just in case. It is confusing when you get down there bc you can't actually see the beach and beach chairs. But yea, don't waste money on a locker. And you have to go back up to the entrance to buy fish food. There is an ATM nearby down the street. We tried the nachos and they were just okay. The guacamole that came with it were very salty. I also didn't like the snorkels. They were constantly getting foggy. Someone who was there while I was got a rash on their leg because they touched the rocks. read more

Fun day trip! Myself and a friend came here for an afternoon from Cancun. We did not take a tour, doing it on our own. The point has beautiful views and sculptures. It was windy and there were waves. You can walk a trail right along the water (and get sea spray) or walk the elevated trail. There is an extra fee to walk out onto the point and see the sculptures. As you enter, there are vendors selling fresh mango and cool ice. It was a very hot day, so thankful for the refreshments. I would definitely come here again. read more

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They are only getting 2 stars because of the employees (they deserve 5 stars) working the bar by the infinity pool, the buffet employees, and the guys running the zip line. They were all awesome and had great customer service. The people running the keys for lockers were super rude and let people cut in line like it was ok. The beach was closed so no snorkeling or any beach access or kayaking. There were no hammocks like they show in videos and there were 4 beds for the whole park and they were already reserved. You aren't allowed to take your phone on the zip line and then they try to sell you a package of pics for one person at $1500 or if we just want one it was $250 per pic. That is a crazy amount of money and left us without any pictures. We went to eat the vip buffet and everything was great with the food! A lot of options to choose from. After we ate we went back down by the pool and sat around bored we decided to see if we could catch the early ferry and go back to our resort. So I went to the little information booth and asked and they said we all had to leave early and that we were going to be moved by taxi to the other side of the island to get on a ferry. The lady was extremely rude when I told her we weren't made aware of this. I speak fluent Spanish and never heard an announcement. There was a man named Marcelino there and he told us we needed to go the main entrance of the park. I asked where that was and he just pointed and told me up there. I was confused because there was a dead end that way. I told him I am sorry I came here on the ferry so I wasn't aware of another entrance. And he kept telling me to go up. Super rude and couldn't even get up off his butt to maybe go show our group the way. Just absolute lack of customer service. I was really upset. The fact that we are paying guests and he could care less! We found the entrance and got into a random taxi that pulled up to take us who knows where! We then were made to sit out in the sun and wait over and hour to get on a ferry to go back. While waiting we had to pay for drinks and snacks at a little store which makes no sense when it was supposed to be included. You should refund your customers for rhe inconveniences throughout the whole day! read more

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This place is near the south end of the island. Golf cart parking is easy, and since the place was not busy, we parked right next to the entrance. The zip line was the highlight of our visit... bring your own towels, they provide a locker (food and drinks we didn't venture to try, and snorkel mask, like jacket, leaking snorkel, and free parking.. read more

Garrafón Park - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

Great place to go and chill out. Is in family plan. There will be open bar. If you buy in advance, can be cheap. Food is ok, (Or bad). But activities are great like snorkel, zip lining, etc. Staff is very friendly and supportive. read more

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I know everyone has different opinions, and I see a lot of negative reviews, but in my case, it wouldn't be fair if I didn't post a positive review. The views are amazing; it doesn't get better than this, believe me. We did the snorkeling activity and had a lot of fun. We definitely enjoyed and relaxed by the infinity pool, just looking at that turquoise water. The workers are very nice and respectful. We didn't get the VIP pass, but the Bucanero buffet (the one we had access to) was just okay. We weren't there for the food anyway. Advice: bring a towel and a full bottle of sunscreen. To make the adventure more fun, book the tour that takes you to swim with dolphins, and the same boat will take you to this park. Enjoy Mexico! read more

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I was very excited to book this excursion with my entire family. There were a total of 22 of us and we all booked separately. The information on the website is a little hard to sift through or to understand but essentially, they really try to upsell you on purchasing the VIP package, which is what happened to us when we actually went to go get our wristbands the day of our excursion, we watched a lot of YouTube videos to understand what to expect and everything look really cool. The lady at the desk knew how old my three children were and still up sold me on the wristbands stating that they could paddleboard and kayak. These were both things that my two girls wanted to do so I of course purchased the upsell. I paid a total of $500, for five of us, this included the fairy to the island lunch, and then I would say the two main activities which is zip lining and snorkeling. When it came time to try and use the paddleboard's in the kayaks, my girls were told that those are for 18 and older. They weren't even allowed to have an adult on them. Then my daughter got in a kayak with her aunt while we were told in line that me and my 14 year old daughter couldn't go on a kayak together , they give you a key for the locker. I miss placed it and understood that I was responsible for the fee to replace it which was five dollars they told us it would either be five dollars in US money or 100 pesos I said of course please unlock the locker and we will go pay it. We go to pay it and they tell us well now it'll be six dollars and I said well. The lady told us it would be five I'm not understanding and they refuse to take the money. Then the staff swarmed us saying you need to pay it. I said we have the money right here no one will take it. I went up to the lady gave her the money and then all the stuff we're staring at us for the rest of the time that we were there. Part of the VIP package is access to the private VIP locker rooms to which they do not tell you about these locker rooms are air-conditioned and wonderful. We were pointed to the locker rooms where there is no AC and is for people who do not pay the VIP package. The drink bar is all the way at the top so if you're down where the activities are or sitting under the shade, you have to walk all the way up, and there was always a long line, making it very difficult to get drinks there. The ferry on the way back was a mess. They heard you on like cattle , we told them that we were waiting for someone to come back from the bathroom as we didn't wanna lose anyone from our party, and they were very pushy and kept telling us to hurry up and get on the boat and we finally told him no, and they were still trying to physically push us into the boat. I've done other boating, excursions like this and the staff are typically very friendly and work very hard you know because they want a tip. This group of staff were all very short, rude, impatient, and expected a tip and walked around with a box like in your face for a tip it was very uncomfortable. I just felt like they really didn't want to earn it was almost expected And after paying $500 for a few hours here at this park, I really would not recommend this to anyone it's a small little area that you get to snorkel and you see very few fish. The zip line is a long wait and the pool was algae green and not fresh at all. That's really all they had to do there. read more

Garrafón Park - View - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

We received a basic pass as part of our Dolphin Encounter ticket. Based on other tips, we paid $20 extra on arrival and upgraded to VIP. The only thing that really did was give us access to a slightly better lunch buffet with better and unlimited cocktails - which were worth it (there was supposed to be jacuzzis but they appeared to be offline). The rest of the complex has a mix of water sports (pool, reef snorkel, kayak, swim) and other activities (zipline, steam bath, etc.). However, they're all pretty downscale experiences. The snorkel is in a narrow lane that parallels the house reef and you can't get close enough to clearly see the fish well. The ziplines are short and fun, but you have to get rid of sunglasses, hat, cell phone, etc. or they won't let you ride (and the line is long). It's a decent value to take the family and spend the day, but less so to just pop in for a few hours. read more

This is a beautiful place to visit. The boat service ran efficiently and on time. Overall, the VIP package was a decent value. However, there is zero food available until noon and then the actual buffet begins at 12:30pm. The food selection is somewhat limited (I was hoping for plenty of fish but was disappointed). A lot of things are in disrepair (some showers not working, bathroom door not locking, etc.). I was not impressed with the attitude of the servers as they seemed bothered to have to do any work. The ocean and pool water was very warm and clear. There is no sandy beach. You need to wear a life preserver at all times in the ocean even if you have 30 years of diving experience. read more

Garrafón Park - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

Save your &. $89 for VIP... snorkeling not good- the reef is dead- not many fish and no variety. Small area for snorkeling- and the steps to get in and out of the water are very painful on your feet. And the workers don't help people get out of the water- actually laughed at a lady trying to get up the stairs. 45 minute wait for zip line. Food- not good. At all. Oh and bring your own towel. There was a misunderstanding with our concierge in the hotel- and even after speaking to management, they would not give us towels. "They are for rent". Absolutely not worth $89. And not good customer service. read more

The location is beautiful with breathtaking ocean views. The infinity pool allows guests to gaze on the ocean while enjoying the cool refreshing water.The zip line with three consecutive stations was fun and efficiently run. The snorkeling activity allowed us to swim through seaweed (not fun) and see a few fish (fun). The kayaks were closed due to the windy weather, much to our disappointment. The food service was terribly slow and the food itself was mediocre. Checking in was inefficient. We were able to get the youth price for two adults and were thankful for the discount. The location earns five stars and the service earns two stars. read more

Garrafón Park - View from Big Fish Restaurant - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

I'm surprised by all of the negative reviews. This was my favorite thing on Isla Mujeres. I was traveling solo in early December, I like activity, and I am not a drinker, so those things may give me a different perspective. I thought the grounds of Garrafon were beautiful. If you are not staying at a resort, but want a day time resort experience I think this is a great place. They have comfortable lounge areas to lay out in the sun, neat huts for shade, and all-inclusive drinks available. The view from their property is stunning. My belongings felt very safe as they have free lockers with keys in their rest area. The restrooms were ok, but the rest of the facilities were very clean and well maintained. The food that comes with the general pass is below average. That is true. But, I didn't come for the food. I had the cheap buffet lunch, and was glad that food was provided as I wanted to enjoy the activities and lay out in the sun. Set your expectation low for the buffet lunch (kids may love it as there are things like hot dogs and fries). The drinks were average. I mainly had juice smoothies (not fresh fruit) and water. It was nice to have there when I wanted it. During my 4 hours at Garrafon, I went zip lining, snorkeling, paddle boarding, enjoyed their infinity pool, and was entertained by people taking their IG model pics. The zip lining isn't super long, but it's a cool experience to do over the beautiful blue water. You get to zip line over the Caribbean! Paddle boarding was neat. I wish the boundaries were bigger to go out more, but it makes sense with the waves. Snorkeling was amazing! I never snorkeled before so this seemed like a great intro. You are not allowed over the rope lines onto the reef, but you can get close. I saw a ton of fish and they got so close. It was sweet. I also went out to the dock to try out the water hammocks (they didn't work super well with a life jacket) and to jump in off the dock. Jumping in was fun, just be careful for the mouthful of saltwater. The pool and the lounge area were refreshing, clean, and comfortable. Great places to relax or soak in the sun. *Note - I did not do the dolphin experience (not included in general admission I got). I paid at the front check in area and it was only $50 (that is cheaper than the deals I found online). That convinced me to go for it. And it was worth it! I think that's a great deal for everything you get for a day at Garrofon. I wish I would've had a couple more hours there. I bought some pictures (but not at full price - as that's too expensive for me) and have some great memories from Mujeres. I'm glad I went for it...maybe you will be, too. read more

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to get to Isla Mujeres by taxi and ferry. They sell you ALL-INCLUSIVE drinks, food, swimming, snorkeling, zip lining, an isla mujeres tour and an interactive dolphin experience - the dolphin experience is the ONLY redeeming activity. You get to Garrafon by 9:45-10am. Only to be told that buffet and food service does not start until 12:30pm. The food was gross, the alcohol beverages were trash and watered down. Because everyone comes hungry - probably starving, you all line up at once, possibly waiting nearly an hour just to eat. So from the time you get there to the time you have to leave at 2:10 for a dolphin experience, there isn't nearly enough time to do what you pay for. The infinity pool is sorry, and small. The bathrooms are beyond disgusting, the snorkeling is boring - the reefs have barely any fish activity and no fins are offered for snorkeling. I didn't have enough time for zip-lining. As much as you pay to come, they should take care of the ground a lot better. The facilities at the dolphin experience are significantly better, the activity with the dolphins is awesome! But it doesn't make sense to pay so much to only enjoy ONE experience out of then SIX they offer. For as much as you pay, they grounds should be better kept. If you come, do the dolphin experience and the dolphin experience ONLY! Don't waste your time and money on anything else! This place is lame, dilapidated, and expensive! PS. Ramon at the dolphin experience was great! read more

Its not an easy access to snorkel. Waves are harsh. Zipline is short and mediocre. We purchased the general admission and the food is disgusting... bland and tasteless. Don't recommend... read more

Garrafón Park - Not good food - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

This is a rip-off and a scam. I visited today based on their website advertising that you could swim/snorkel a coral reef. You are not allowed to actually do that. They intentionally lie to get guests. I requested a partial refund and they refused. I was extremely kind and courteous when I filed this complaint. I spoke with a manager, Ricardo. I asked him for a partial refund because there was no coral reef to view during snorkeling. He told me we do not advertise that you can do so. I anticipated this and showed him the images that I have attached here. They have multiple images of people swimming in close proximity to the reef. They also say, "you will be able to swim around the entire reef". Despite showing him this proof he refused to give me even a partial refund after his associate Oscar lied and said that he showed me some sort of information that said I cannot swim with the reef. I have also attached the information that was provided. He then told me to write a formal complaint on a provided form. I did so. He told me that he needed it to make "the company better". I told him my consulting services in this matter came to $98. He didn't like my joke. I told him again, you want me to pay you $100 for your lies. He still upheld that they were not lying. I submit the images attached for you to evaluate. Oscar did nothing but try and up sell me to their VIP package and explained that I could snorkel, zip line, eat, etc. I thanked them for their time, left, and stopped a four folks outside who were about to go in and told them that there was no snorkeling at the coral reef and they left. Oscar, Ricardo, you could have refunded me $98 and I would of kept quiet, but here you go, Amigos. You thought you would call my bluff. Mistake. You're down $392 already. read more

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This is a small park with lots to do. We got upgraded to the VIP premium package and enjoyed the best views and food (Nachos are freshly made and unbelievably delicious). Short zip lines, easy snorkeling with lots of fish, although light in variety. Drinks flow freely. And we lounged on chairs in the upper deck in the pool which kept us nice and cool. Such a great way to spend the day read more

The location 10/10 the water 10/10 the tezmecal 10/10 the staff , the service , the food absolutely disgusting -10/10 everyone was bitter and not willing to help the food was gross old and cold . read more

Disregard the negative reviews. First world complaints of not being pampered. How can beer be watered down? It's an open bar! Does everyone want to be sh-faced by noon? Lol! The property was clean, hand sanitizer everywhere. Zip line, snorkeling, kayak, stand up paddle board, open bar, mayan sauna and buffet were included! The ferry picked us up at the park dock! A great place to relax, take it slow and enjoy your vacay! I wish i did the dolphin experience! read more

Loved the few activities I got to do and overall the park is AMAZING. So beautiful and breath taking. The only issue I have is that I got the whole package but yet, the clear kayak boat wasn't available, nor was the paddle boat, and bungee jumping. Also, I feel like the park closes just a bit too early. 6pm would be a good time to start closing. read more

I went with a party of 8 adults and we all enjoyed our day there. We went with the VIP pass and I'm glad we did! Most of our day was spent lounging on the adult VIP deck, the food was surprisingly good and the service was all around great! We were lucky enough to have Ramiro serve us all day, he was wonderful and made our day! Zip lining was so much fun. Unlike most of my previous zip line experiences this one was faster, as in they prepped you and had you up and going within 10 minutes. We could've gone multiple times but only went once. It was too rough for kayaking or snorkeling which was pretty disappointing but the area looked small anyway. Infinity pool was great, the little grottos looked really cool. Hammocks are a nice touch although we didn't use them. It was a good spot to take a day trip (we were in Cancun at the Hard Rock for 7 days) although I couldn't see myself spending much more time there as its limited to activities. read more

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Absolutely loved my experience here. Went with 9 year old boy and really glad we took the VIP package. The price difference was minimal but we got to do the zip line unlimited number of times. Actually, we did it 7 times. The zip line is comprised of 3 different lines. This was the best activity of the day. My so. Also enjoyed the trampoline and then VIP lounge was amazing- more drink options and their flank steak and salmon were to die for. We both enjoyed it. Highly recommend to try their drink "riviera maya" - only available at the VIP lounge Other major difference aside from food are the lockers and shower facilities. Plus, if you take the first arrival time, breakfast with fruit and drinkable coffee is available at the lounge. When we arrived, it rained for about 30 min, which gave us an opportunity to enjoy breakfast and a few drinks as well as the VIP exclusive hot tubs and pool. If you are going to this park for snorkelling , you maybe disappointed. I recommend going to xel-ha instead. Kayaking was fun, but the area for this activity is very small. Unless you like to waste time and spend more $$$, then perhaps swimming with daulphins is your thing. For me, they are slimy and do not smell that great. Plus if you want one of these things to kiss you, be prepared to pay more money!!! Glad I skipped this and instead got to spend an extra 2.5 hrs zip lining and had supper just before the lounge closed at 4:30. After that, the bar near the trampoline offers beers and bottled pop until 5 pm. read more

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Wonderful time here. Tried snorkeling for the first time. It was great. The panoramic pool overlooking the waters is beautiful and relaxing. Plenty of space to lay out and relax in the sun. Great spot for some fun activities. read more

Garrafón Park is overpriced, waste of time, and a ripoff. I didn't see anything while a was snorkeling cuz you don't even go anywhere you can't go across the lines the have. You could also only go zip lining once and it was a very small zip line too. You could do so many things in Mexico that would be better and cheaper. Oh and the all "inclusive food" that we payed more money for is ABSOLUTELY HORRIBLE! read more

Had an amazing time there with my friends. We did all the activities. The zip lining was awesome. The pool with the waterfall makes for great pics. The snorkeling was great. The the MVP of it all was Mario at the VIP lounge/ buffet. That man is amazing. He's absolutely awesome. He kept bringing us food and drinks. I literally felt at home with him. He needs a raise. I will go back just because of him. read more

Garrafón Park - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

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Oh if I could only leave negative stars! This place is terrible. First you are trapped on a boat for about 45 minutes with loud, constant, repetitive announcements. I appreciated them telling people to take bags off of seats to make space for other passengers, but after hearing the announcement sneak times, in 3 languages, you've got to think that "hey, maybe signs on the tables would be a good idea!". It was unreal. Each time we felt we could talk and enjoy the ride there would be another announcement. Then you get to a place with no real beach to speak of. You walk on a dock and get into the water from there. You are permitted to swim in the designated areas only. NOTE that I wrote swim. This is because there are no places for fish to hide, no rocks, no reef. I've seen more fish in my bath tub at home! You cannot call that snorkeling. Kayaking? Same thing. You are only permitted in a small area that borders the swim area. Nothing of interest to see. Zip lining? Uh NO WAY! After having read the review below of the terrible injury that happened there! It was our intention to spend the day the as we had no interest in shopping at Isla Mujeres. We were trapped there. Like fish in a barrel people kept coming to offer us stuff that may actually have interesting or fun. I felt for the money we paid there should have been something there. There are way better ways to spend your money and way better places to go. read more

Nice place to spend good time with friends... Food is good... Miss when it was part of XCARET GROUP... read more

Garrafón Park - Nice place to spend a Sunday with friends... Not as good as when it belonged to GRUPO XCARET... But the discounted price is worth... - Amusement Parks Near Me - Isla Mujeres, ROO

This park is very unorganized. We bought the VIP pass and had to wait in line to do all the activities. No tour guide to help schedule any of the activities. Swimming with dolphins is at a complete different park. Also the people who work at the park are rude and very unhelpful. I would recommend going to XPLORE or XEL-HA to get the best time out of your money. read more

Very cool park. My sister and I ended up here late in the day so we only got a pass to the ziplining and snorkeling. I wish the park was open later. We are complete newbies to snorkeling so we thought it was great as we have nothing to compare it to. I liked that the park took pictures of us ziplining. It's hard to get your own pictures so while you have to buy them at the end, it's worth it to me. I would like to try the VIP experience sometime if we come back with more time and maybe make a whole day out of it. I didn't try any of the food so I can't comment on that, but all in all, this was part of a great day we spent on the island! read more

Great park. I like that you have different options. You can go just snorkeling or kayaking or do a package deal. The place is reasonably priced. The staff is also pretty helpful and speak English. I did just the snorkeling but maybe in the future I'd do a package deal. read more

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I went ziplining at Garrafon. When I went for the second zipline the equipment malfunctioned and dropped me into the landing barrier. What was supposed to be a fun trip ended up with my leg having three fractures and a dislocated ankle. While the company paid for my care i. Mexico, they are refusing to refund my tickets, or help me with the permanent, life long damages that their faulty equipment have done to me. I'm out of work and can no longer take care of myself. Stay away from this resort, it is unsafe. They offered me free tickets to go back. As if I would EVER let any of my family go to this place. You have permanently injured me and affected my career, and I will never let my friends or family go to this resort. read more

Okay but about $40 US dollars overpriced for the experience. You are required to stay until 5pm, but you are ready to leave by 1:30pm. The ziplining could be higher or longer. One or two more activites would be nice. If they reduced the price a bit and allowed you to leave earlier (the boat only comes at 5pm), the experience would be much better. read more

I would give this 0 stars if possible. Soooo lame... we paid 70$ each and left an 30 minutes later and of course the refused a refund. The snorkel area is as big as bath tub, the kayak area is a joke, pool is merky, booze is cheap and the food and bathrooms are sewer. All inclusive at its worst.. I specifically remember walking in and asking my wife why everyone looked miserable... now i know. There is another place on isla mujeres called garrafon de castille. DO NOT CONFUSE this for that. Thanks for the clown and wasting almost an hour of our lives. Blahhhhh read more

We went as part of a package with a dolphin encounter. Garrafon park was the second part of the tour. The ref park has lots to do. Zip line, infinity pool, unlimited food and drinks for the VIP group, small Playground for kids, snorkeling (they have gear), hammocks, lockers, and showers. There is not a whole lot on the snorkeling area to see they make you wear a life vest. There is an adult only area upstairs that has small hot tubs for those that do not have kids with them. You can easily spend all day here relaxing and doing various activities. They take pictures of you on the zip line and you can purchase in the gift shop. read more

Food and drinks were awful. Snorkeling and kayaking was confined to a very small spot. Water was too rough to snorkel. Pass was too expensive and on top of that you can't use your camera for the zip line because they want you to buy their pictures for a ridiculous amount of money. No thanks I will not come here again. It's not worth it. The only nice thing here is the view. read more

Horrible very boring. Zip lining was mediocre at best. Half the stuff was closed and you could only zip line once. Way too small snorkeling zone and I saw maybe one fish. WAY TOO OVERPRICED!! read more

Pretty nice. We went on the zip line. We wanted to use the kayaks or go snorkeling but the seas were too rough so it was closed. The food and drinks were ok. We walked down to Punta Sur and found a couple small caves to explore. read more

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This place is rip off. The bathrooms stank like a sewer, the buffet was swarming with flies and the food was stale/left out in the heat, we couldn't eat it. The snorkeling area was tiny and we barely saw any fish. The staff acted like they couldn't be bothered by the guests. The pool was WAY over crowded and cloudy, wouldn't set foot in that water. There was no beach area to enjoy the waves. Worst time ever.... read more

The park is nice and clean, the kayaks are like 4 for all the park, and there is a lot of people. The VIP section is very nice and the service is great!! The park will be much better if is they put more kayaks and invest more space and fish in the snorkeling area. read more

I wouldn't bother with this place if you are at a resort with amenities . The snorkeling was not snorkeling they do not use fins and the trail did have more than a few fish. Zip line is ok - basic. Food was basic. Best part was the hammocks. Not enough shade for everyone to relax in. Wouldn't recommend a full day of your vacation if it wS a half day it'd be better or take a catamaran to the snorkel or dive spots outside of this park to experience the reef. Staff was ok- some were rude when I told them no photos which they constantly are doing. A bit cheesy for me. read more