We recently had a section of our bamboo hardwoods replaced by Joe Hardwood Floors. These floors were pretty old, and I tried to find the closest match possible. Joe was very responsive throughout the process and came out day 1 to give me a free quote and quoted me 3 different options. The guys who completed the work were very professional and did a good job of installing. For patching a floor with new wood next to old wood, they made it work in a way to works for us which is a challenging task. Not only that, but they found some floor joist issues below the plywood and were able to fix those on top of installing the floors, which is very impressive for a flooring company to be able to handle on the spot. Joe was very responsive throughout the process and answered every call I had. My only difficulty was that it was challenging explaining what we needed with workers who couldn't speak English. This led to me having to call Joe a lot and there were a few small items that weren't done exactly as I'd have liked due to language barriers, but they were nothing major and doesn't change the 5 star review. Would highly recommend using Joe or getting a quote for all flooring needs. read more

Joe was extremely helpful with helping my husband and I refinish our floors. As first time home owners we had little to no knowledge of what we wanted to do to our old oak floors, but we knew that we wanted to give them a fresh new look. Our floors were in a pretty terrible condition, but Joe and his team did an amazing job at making them look brand new and they look better than we could have ever imagined. He made sure to keep us updated throughout the whole process and answer any questions we had. I would highly recommend Joe and his team as they were quick, affordable, and reliable. read more

Order: Remove existing Bamboo floors on second floor and stairs. Inspect the floors and area of water damage.; make necessary repairs. Install new hardwood floors, conduct final inspection. Estimate Total: $7,814.16. (May 2018) Job was Completed the first week of December 2018. Final Cost: Stairs: $2,369 (16 Stairs) Labor: $3,136.50 (597 Square feet) $3,536.84 (Wood) Total: $9,042.34 Note: Joe said the cost of the wood went up because of the Tariffs and trade wars. This caused the wood price to go up and my final price to increase. This also includes the additional hidden cost for leveling (I will discuss this in further detail below) Joe (Owner): Very nice and completed a fast quote in a timely manner. Does not perform an on-site post job inspection. Very hard to get a hold of to fix an issue. Will not fix an issue if it will cost him more money. Contract (estimate): Very detailed, I highly recommend you read every section and have a clear understanding of the contact before he performs work. One of the hidden contract fees are leveling, Joe gave me a very not good answer as to why this is not included in the initial estimate. I was charged an additional $540 for 6 square feet of concrete in various locations. I would have been ok with the charge, he could have at least had an estimated cost. As his contracts say estimate at the top. I take the blame for not accounting for this cost, I did not think I would have to pay an extra $500. I did not take off for this in my final three-star rating. Communication: Very poor, I had issues after the job, and he would not answer the phone. I would call for a few days before I received a response. He will respond rapidly if you offer him a new job. Then he would recommend fixing the issue with the new job. None of the workers speak English very well or at all, I don't have a problem with this issue. I did have a problem when they did not re-install the stand on my cabinets. They did not understand the issue and I still have a stand not install on my cabinet. Cleanliness: The workers left wood dust daily and left a shirt and wood pieces. The workers retrieved the shirt three days after I let Joe know. Joe apologized. Workers: The workers changed twice in during the job, I would have liked to have the same workers every-day. Or at least one familiar face. Craftsmanship: I had a squeak in my floor during installation, I alerted the guys as the installed the floors. They ignored me (communication issue), once completed I alerted Joe and he had them come out two weeks later and use all of my extra wood to fix the issue. The squeak is still in my floors. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

These guys totally dropped the ball this time. Our pipes burst this past freeze, and our wood floors were ruined. We had a good experience with JHF previously, and thought they'd be who we work with. Nope. They came out to give an estimate and take a measurement. They said they'd drop off the samples the next day and never showed up. No call. No show. I called two different numbers and left voicemails. Nothing. We REALLY need floors, and Joe Hardwood Floors just can't deliver. Don't waste your time. Also, don't go with Lowe's either. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - We need floors now! - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

Joe and Steve were a great team to work with. We were so impressed by the transformation they were able to achieve and can't recommend them highly enough! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - a hardwood floor in a home - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

My husband hired this guy to do our floor and we left him a $3,000 deposit. It is now almost 3 weeks and he still HAS NOT REFUNDED US! Joe if you're reading this, please refund me so we can end this already!!!! What is taking so long? read more

Honest and knowledgeable to consult for my floor issue. Quality people and recommendations

Joe and Steve are a great team to work with. I had to replace the flooring in a master bedroom along with two closets due to a recent water leak within the house. Joe came out for an estimate a few days after the incident and his crew began the work within a week after I bought my own flooring material. Steve was in constant communication with me throughout the process when I had questions. They did the work in less than three days and the new flooring looks better than what I had before. read more

Update 2/22. Joe replied to my email directly. Thank you, Joe. Although the problem in the wood flooring has not been fixed I do want to acknowledge that Joe replied to my email directly as requested. Update 2/21 company still does not reply to my email directly but publicly posts in Yelp. I am asking for direct contact with me in response to my email but only seem to get a response here. That's one of many reasons I won't change my negative review and will not do so until you reply to my email(s) and fix the floors that started warping prior to heavy rains. To be fair I upgraded to two stars because they visited the home, but no work has been done, I'm tripping on the warped floor and no one will tell me directly how to fix the problem. Two stars is a stretch considering how much money we paid and the service we got/are getting. Our door frame/threshold has not changed since floors were installed why wasn't it an issue then? I will not change this rating until the problem is fixed or you tell me how to fix it and quit pestering my husband asking him to take down this negative review. Pros: They installed wood floors in our home. Cons: They said the foreman would be there on the day I chose stain colors. Foreman was not there and crew member did not speak English. Couldn't get in touch with boss on the phone. Boss man came to pick up final check by dropping by unannounced on a Sunday and basically refusing to leave without a check. A few months after they installed floors, humps in flooring appeared in two rooms. I contacted foreman and foreman's boss and heard nothing. Bumps grew larger and now the floor is splitting. Boss man and foreman not returning my husband's calls or emails. read more

I recently used Joe Hardwood to lay hardwood floors in my study. The entire process took about two weeks. A few days into the installation, I noticed that the door to my study would no longer open completely, as the wood that was installed was raised slightly above the bottom edge of the door. I brought this up to Joe as soon as I noticed it, as I wanted to give them an opportunity to fix it before the wood was stained or polyurethane was added. I was told "Don't worry, it's normal, it will shrink once the alcohol has dried". Needless to say, it didn't shrink, and I kept bringing it up to Joe as the installation progressed. Each time I brought it up, I got the same answer, even up to the next to last day of the installation: "It's normal, don't worry. It will shrink." Well after the last day of the installation, after everything had dried, I check my study and my door opened normally. It was a hardwood miracle! Not quite. Upon closer inspection, it appears that the installers cut off about a centimeter from the bottom of my door in order to allow it to open. And they did it without my consent too! The worst part is, when they cut the door, the saw that they used noticeably chipped the paint on the door along their entire cut (See picture). To be fair, the price that Joe had quoted was fair, and the wood that they installed does look great and blends in nicely with my existing hardwood floors. But given this company's propensity to be dismissive of their customer's concerns, and perform alterations to their property without the homeowner's consent, I wouldn't recommend them to anyone. UPDATE 5/8/2017 Joe reached out to me personally shortly after my initial review. He has agreed to have someone come out and repair my door. I will update this review once the situation has been resolved. UPDATE 5/13/2017 Joe was extremely apologetic about the damage that was caused to my door and had it repaired immediately. He was professional in his handling of the situation and he noted that the employee who had altered my home without my consent is no longer working for him (although for other reasons). I really believe that this was just a communications mixup and would be glad to use Joe Hardwood again in the future. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Joe Hardwood Floors cut my door without my consent, and left it noticeably chipped! - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

Joe and Steve were a pleasure to work with. Joe was very knowledgeable and provided his expertise in finding the right solutions to refinish my floors. Stev was my go-to contact and he kept me updated every step of the way. The work was impeccable and I love my new floors. If you're looking for any flooring services please don't overlook Joe Hardwood Floors. They do great work and worked within my budget! I'll definitely be referring their services and using them in the future! read more

Joe hardwood floors is my go-to company when I need the original 1938 hardwoods of my apartment complex refinished. They take great care in honoring the age and originality of our flooring. Their prices are reasonable and their work shows craftsmanship and experience. There was a small hiccup on our most recent job that was quickly remedied and resolved without question or issue. If you're familiar with construction and remodeling you know unexpected issues can and will arise, but the manner in which Joes responded and dealt with the problem is exactly what I expect out of a subcontractor. Will absolutely hire again and will refer them to clients. read more

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Came to our home to give us an estimate for refinishing our bamboo flooring on January 16th. We were told we would have a quote by the 18th. That didn't happen so we followed up through Yelp on January 23rd and 30th. Both messages were read, but zero follow up whatsoever. Unfortunately we will have to get quotes elsewhere, big waste of time. read more

I decided to get an estimate from Rob who runs Joe Hardwood Floors after our home flooded in May. His estimate came in at a price that I felt was very competitive and incredibly reasonable given the positive feedback he has on Yelp and Google. He was always on time to meet up, he scheduled a specific date he would begin and end his work (and he stuck to the schedule!!), and he also stayed true to his original estimate for the cost of the job; this is more than I can say for just about any contractor we've hired over the years. I was concerned that the floors would look different. I loved the color, type of wood, and look of our older floors and I saved a few of the trashed boards to show Rob and his guys so they knew what color and type of wood we used to have. They made them look just like our old floors, but even better. He really got the color, look, and quality to be perfect. Any questions or concerns I had, Rob was always quick to reply. I will absolutely call Rob at Joe Hardwood Floors if I move and need to upgrade flooring at a new residence! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - My camera isn't doing the floor justice.. these floors are gorgeous!!! Floors were installed throughout 1100 sq.ft of home. - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

These guys are quick to give a quote (and very detailed quote) and are more than willing to answer any/all your questions. I had to have my wood floors recoated and had to have this done while out of town. I didn't have to worry about them working with the building's management -- they took care of that all on their own and made the process easy. Not only did they give me a fair quote, but they updated me throughout the process and had a quick turnaround recoating the unit. Not to mention -- they did a great job! An excellent company that I would recommend to anyone in the Houston area. read more

Joe came out to the house as we were in desperate need of getting floors refinished. Not only was able to advise us on flooring but he also put our minds at ease leaving our home for a week for them to be done. He and his techs were incredibly professional and trustworthy. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors did an excellent job on marble tile flooring. JR was excellent and very accommodating. We shopped out the job to 4 other companies and Joe Hardwood was the most competitive. They arrived on time and knocked out a 3 day project in 1 1/2 days. Highly recommend. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Half bath marble inlay. - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

My house had dark walnut floors with gloss polyurethane. They were terrible. When we decided to pull the trigger on getting them redone to prep for sale, Joe Hardwood had the most reasonable quote without cutting corners on material or manpower. The guys explained the process exactly as it happened, and all the little spots that have bothered me for years are nowhere to be found. Just look at the photos, they did an amazing job. We did a satin finish over the nutmeg, btw. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Satin finish over nutmeg stain color, on red oak - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

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I had my nearly 100 year old hardwoods refinished and they couldn't have come out better! Tony was great to work with and answered all my questions! I was surprised at how affordable the job was! I wish I had it done years ago! Will definitely use this company again! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - a hardwood floor in a kitchen - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

I do not normally respond to comments from business owners, however, Rob's comments are inaccurate and I'd like to address them for the benefit of the Yelp community. Both of the estimates I received were based on the same scope of work. Both estimates accounted for the pet stains and non-standard 2" wood. So it was 100% apples to apples. Yes, I was unhappy with the owner about the situation as she should have disclosed this damage prior to the sale, but that did not affect my interaction with either flooring company. As far as I know, there are no inspection companies that move rugs or furniture during a home inspection. What I wanted was an accurate estimate for the work to be done and to understand how much I would have to pay out of pocket. The one star review is because Joe Hardwood failed to provide that and was unprofessional in the process. At no point did Rob bring up his concern about having the moving company pay for a portion of it, he simply said he wouldn't provide an estimate for that area until I signed a contract for them to do the work. Here is what he said verbatim: "Once you accept my offer, I can prepare an estimate for the folks that damaged the wood." Finally, the appointment time with the sanding technician was set for Friday at 10am. Here is our email exchange, verbatim: Me: "I am meeting the roofer at the house on Thursday at 3:30 and I am meeting the contractor on Friday at 10am. Can the sanding technician come around either of those times?" Rob: "On Friday, my sanding tech has a busy day, I'll try to make 10am work. If its not possible I will let you know." I didn't hear anything so I was expecting the sanding tech on Friday at 10am. At no point did I indicate that I was flexible or did he say it would be sometime over the weekend. Rob, I think if you revisit our emails you will find the truth is quite different from what you posted. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors (JHF) restained, repaired, and refinished our floors. They changed the color completely from an ugly light tan floors to a beautiful coffee brown. The whole process was much easier than I thought it would be. I found JHF online by simply searching for Hardwood Floors Houston and called the number just to get an idea of what I was getting into. Rob Navon, the owner, promptly returned my call, walked me through the process and made time to come out to my home to quote us a price. We had something like 1,400 square feet, so the total price (which included the alcohol treatment for dark floors) came out to about $2.66/SF, seemed competitive from the research I did. Once we decided to move forward, we then worked with the project manager, Ozzie, to execute the plan. Ozzie was great. He was very professional, honest, and punctual. He came in to look at the job, then mapped out a timeline in which to complete the work. I think his estimate was accurate to the minute. He really helped us pick out the color of the floor by explaining to us all the various other tones that could be seen in the numerous browns we considered (they can also do all those blacks, whites, and various shades of gray in between). Our big difficulty was the language barrier between myself and the painting crew that I hired on the side. Ozzie was so helpful with the communication, really explaining to them when they could work in the house and when they had to vacate to let the floor people do their thing. I highly recommend Joe Hardwood Floors to anybody refinishing their floors. read more

We just bought a house and wanted to get our floors re-done, and we're so happy we went with Joe Hardwood Floors. They're as professional as you can get, but they're also extremely affordable. We were able to get an estimate immediately, and they finished the job when they said they would. Also, they are very good at communicating with me on everything that was going on, and I could not be happier. I highly recommend them!!! read more

We recently decided to replace the carpet in two bedrooms of our house with hardwood floors. I contacted three hardwood floor companies - two that I found by researching on line and one that was a personal recommendation. Joe's Hardwood Floors was one that I found on line and I was immediately impressed. I initially talked to Rob Navon, the owner, and scheduled a meeting with him for the following day. I think it only took about 20 minutes for him to talk with me, measure and prepare a quote. I had already received a quote from the company that was personally recommended and Rob's pricing was half of the other quote I received. I accepted his bid on the spot and canceled my appointment with the third company. I knew I had found a company that was professional, reasonable and would provide good work. The day after I signed the bid, I received a phone call from the project manager, Ossie, to discuss the overall process and timeline for the project. They were able to put me on the schedule very quickly. Ossie arrived on the first day so he could assess the type of wood and stain that would match the existing hardwoods in my hallway. He helped me find a stain that matched my existing floors really well, which is quite a feat considering they are an unknown mix of three different stain colors. Rob was very responsive, personable and professional and Ossie was a total delight. He is incredibly organized and really cares about making the customer happy. He accommodated all of my requests and did it with good humor and patience. The process went very smoothly and was completed in the exact amount of time as promised. Anyone who has done any renovation work knows that is quite a rarity! I am very pleased to highly recommend Joe's Hardwood Floors. read more

Second time using Joe's Hardwood floor. As always I got several bids. Rob Navon came by and quick assessed that floors were quarter sawn; none of the previous companies even said that. Ozzie his right head guy is professional and has a sense of urgency. Highly recommend them. Trust their guys in my home too. You get what you pay for with Joe's Hardwood Floors! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Beautiful quarter sawn floors look amazing! - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

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I called around getting quotes to replace about 800 sq. ft. of carpet with hardwood. Joe's had the best price I was able to find. Ossie was my point of contact for the project and he laid out the schedule of exactly what was going to happen. It was about 2.5 weeks start to finish including time for letting wood settle and the coats to dry. My railing is a large single piece of metal that goes up 2 floors which is a bit unusual, but Joe Hardwood were able to work around it and make it look good. Ossie was available to answer any questions I had by text. The crew were polite and respectful. Overall I'm extremely pleased with them. read more

Came quickly to do the estimate, and said they would provide the quote to me the following day. After following up with them 3 times over 5 days, I gave up. Never received the quote. read more

I recently bought a house and wanted to replace the carpet on 41 stairs and 4 landings with hardwood. I spoke with several hardwood contractors and found Joe Hardwood floors on Yelp. I called to set up an appointment for a quote on a Monday and Rob and Joe came out to the house that afternoon. They showed up with samples of hardwood colors and we walked through the house while I explained the look I was going for. Rob and Joe both took notes and measurements and we picked out a color sample that matched perfectly to my pre-existing hardwood floors (Gunstock Oak). Within 10 minutes of completing the walk-through they had a very detailed quote printed out for me to review. The quote had the cost broken out by labor hours, materials, quantities, and rates. I was very impressed with the attention to detail in the quote, so I asked when they could start. I was shocked when they said they could have someone out the next morning at 8:30am. They guys showed up at 8:30 sharp the next morning (Tuesday) and started the demolition and floor prep. They took Wednesday to procure the materials and Thursday they returned to start the installation. They were finished by Friday! Then, I had the painters come out to paint the walls and the risers on the stairs. The painters took about two weeks, but once the painters were finished Rob and Joe came back out to the house to do a final walk trough and punch out as promised. They sealed the bull nose the next morning and the project was finished. To conclude, I was incredibly impressed with Joe Hardwood Floor attention to detail and punctuality. The entire Joe Hardwood Floors team is full of true professionals and they take pride in providing quality work. They completed 41 stairs and 4 landings, which is a difficult project by any standard in under a week and the price, timeliness, and quality of work was superb. I feel that the price I paid for the quality of work I received was a steal. I highly recommend Joe Hardwood Floors for any hardwood flooring project. Thank you. -Ryan read more

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I'm really pleased with the job that Rob and everyone at Joe Hardwood did for us. Very professional, on schedule, great communication and a fair price. I especially like how much input we had in the stain color selection. We ended up with a really rich and deep color, and whenever people visit our house the first thing they always compliment is the floor color. So I highly recommend them! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Refinished and ready for move in! - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

I was a week away from the close of the sale of my house and had to make some quick repairs to my hardwoods ASAP. Joe Hardwood Floors was one of 3 quotes I got. Not only did they quote me the fastest they were also extremely competitive and accommodated my tight schedule. His crew of 2 came out, replaced part of my flooring, repaired a significant scratch without replacing boards and it is as the damaged spots never existed. It is hard to get good service with great quality and pricing these days, but Joe Hardwood Floors definitely provides all 3. Keep up the good work! read more

Joe's Hardwood Floors was one of the 3 companies that I called to get a bid to refinished my wood floors. I hired this guy last year to refinish my floors and after the second try the floors look horrible. Joe's team came to re-refinish my floors, and they exceed my expectations. My floors are beautiful again they look brand new. My floors are alive!! Thank you Ossie!! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - The hallway - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

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We use Joe Hardwood to replace second floor carpets to hardwood floors in our new house. After compared several bids and reviews, we felt that Rob is very professional so we chose them even though we have to raise our budgets a bit. The work product is great, color recommended is matched to first floor and wood looked smooth. We are very happy about it. Hope Rob would give us some discount when we replace the third floor :) read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

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If you are stressing over having your hardware floors refinished, or simply dolled up - relax. These guys are fantastic. I used them at least six years ago for a total refinishing job. Then upon my tenants move, they needed a facelift. The result - beautiful. The crew was friendly, competent and a pleasure to work with. Rob was on it with a bid in no time. I heartily recommend Joe Hardware Floors. You will be delighted. read more

Joe Hardwood Floors did an excellent job installing my engineered hardwood flooring. The communication with Rob, the owner, was prompt & honest. The workers were exactly on time, highly efficient, very clean, super fast, worked non-stop, didn't waste a minute, & finished the job earlier than expected. I was very impressed with their expertise & efficiency. The quote I got was way less than the quote from Lumber Liquidators! I am very happy I chose Joe Hardwood! My rooms look much better without carpet. Thanks to Rob & his workers for a beautiful job! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Shiny, beautiful new flooring! - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

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This company is not the old joe hardwood floors. This owner started the job dec 9 2017 and finally finished jan 11 2018. They worked three days and left for two weeks. It was a hit and miss with broken promises! This part of the job was to remove old tar and put done screeds and plywood. I would not recommend this company. I selected them based on previous reviews which are not applicable to this company. read more

Joe's Hardwood Floors refinished the hardwood floors on a home for me as well as fixed a terrible hole from the previous owners. Joe came out to the home to do a walk through and provided a fair estimate for the job. He was able to schedule his crew to get started very quickly. Joe provided good information on the different types of stains and well as the seals that would be good for the space. His crew tested a few stain options and made sure I was satisfied with the stain color before proceeding with the job. His crew was very professional in the home and were able to finish the job in just a few days. The hole they fixed looked as good as new and perfectly matched the floors. Joe was able to answer questions and gave suggestions on how to keep up with the floors. They did a beautiful job refinishing the hardwoods and the repairs. The floors look incredible! read more

Joe Hardwood Floors - Before hole/patch - Flooring Near Me - Houston, Texas

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This review is a long time coming, as we had our carpet replaced 3 years ago (to match the engineered wood the previous owners had partially put in), but the work was wonderful, quick, and professional. Rob was always extremely quick to respond to questions (I think I made the first inquiry Christmas weekend), and provided great service overall. I recently sent an unrelated email to him and he responded right away, too. They were willing to fix issues we spotted and were willing to work with us on the order we wanted to do the rooms. I would use them again! read more

I contacted Joe Hardwood floors via YELP messaging to request a quote on material and labor for floor installation. Robert could not get the floor product so I asked about a labor only estimate and gave him the square footage. I asked him for suggestions to source the product and followed up with the requirements the building had regarding liability insurance for contractors. Robert replied with questions about the location zip code, and size of the building. Let me preface this by stating he had been prompt and engaging with his replies to this point. I provided him the location zip code and size of the building. No response. 3 days go by and I sent a follow up "did you forget about me?" message. No response. I have not heard from Robert in 6 days. I then read more closely the negative reviews he has gotten on YELP. Mario S. posted in 11/2014 that he was also asked what zip code in which he lived and was then treated unworthy when he provided his zip code. I have also read the other negative reviews Joe Hardwoods has received. My opinion is that Robert is hostile and accusatory of the person posting the negative review (See Kim R's review of 5/16/2016). Robert's reply was "please don't pay any attention to this review." I am so paying attention to that exact review because the way you respond to people makes me relieved I did not contract with you to do my job. If everyone had a 5 star experience and every customer was a satisfied customer, we would live in a perfect world. We do not. There will be unhappy customers, Robert. Being nice and conciliatory goes much further than "don't pay attention to this review," or "perhaps you were not paying attention when we discussed my terms" (your reply to Mary S. customer 2/2016). Robert, I know you will have some comments to post about my 1 star review but review our messaging transcript for the facts before doing so. read more

I've never seen floors that scratch this easily. I've lived in 4 houses with wood floors and this is the first that are this "delicate". Within the first 4-6 weeks of having the floors done by Joe Hardwood Floors, we had scratches all over the floor. Rob (the owner) was very attentive when he collected our payment but after, he disappeared. He said he would come back to fix the floor but after months of the getting the runaround I realized that he had no intention of fixing it. read more

High quality work on time and on budget. We asked them to match some existing high end oak flooring that was already in the house. They matched it so well that I literally can't tell the difference. They were also less than a local competitor. Strongly recommended. read more

I picked them because of high reviews. Rob (the owner) was honest and fair on price. There was a big mistake on the bid given by one of Rob's employees and Rob honored the price given by the employee. Quality of work was good too. I will use him for any floors in the future. read more