Me and my husband are first time buyers. Planning to move our family of 5 with 3 little ones to another city is no easy feat especially with no experience whatsoever. We decided to go with Bern simply out of whim and we are so glad we did! We met him end of August and we have successfully moved in since November! He made sure the process was easy for us and hassle free, making sure we got what we wanted with a sense of humour. He will make sure you get a house you love and will go the extra mile to take care of everything before you get in. Make sure you stalk his youtube videos! Bern is an awesome agent but more so a friend you wanna make if you move to another city! Thanks Bern! read more

We enjoyed working with Bern on our recent home purchase in the San Carlos neighborhood. We were relocating from Washington DC, and Bern made a cross-country home purchase and move as smooth as possible. Thanks! read more

Bern and the entire off the 56 team are AMAZING! We've enjoyed Bern's YouTube videos in the past and enjoyed working with him even more. He has in-depth knowledge about San Diego neighborhoods and vast real estate experience in general. He is always a text or phone call away, even on weekends and vacation days. He stays on top of each step in home buying process like getting offers accepted, inspections, getting required estimates, negotiating seller credits, closing etc which has made the whole process so seamless and easy for us. We were looking for a fixer-upper for a good deal and making the updates ourselves, he helped us achieve exactly that. Bern's recommendations and suggestions on home repairs/updates and contractors have been invaluable for us. We would definitely recommend him and he'll be our go-to for any real estate needs in the future. Special shout-out to Mike, he stays behind the scenes most of the time I think, but we've had the pleasure of meeting him a few times, he's been so kind and patient with us. read more

My husband and I greatly enjoyed working with our Realtor - Bern McGovern to find our dream home in SD! Bern knew the answers to our many questions and worked very hard to earn our trust and business. We loved his ideas and suggestions for our SD home search and ultimately our new home. He also did an amazing job recommending trustworthy and hardworking contractors to help us with our new home. Although making the move from the SF Bay Area to SD was a super stressful time for us, Bern definitely helped make the experience less stressful and smooth sailing as possible. Thank goodness we had Bern!! read more

There are some people you come across in your life that are truly special. Bern McGovern is one of those people. My wife I and discovered Bern's YouTube channel (https://www.youtube.com/c/LivinginSanDiegoCA) around the same time we were considering moving to San Diego. A particular new construction neighborhood caught our eye and we wanted a realtor to advise and advocate for us. As the new home neighborhood progressed the builder decided to not offer an agent commission. Bern generously kept advising and talking to us even when there was no financial incentive to do so. Eventually we grew tired of the builder's antics and decided to look for a private resale house. Bern was ready and willing to help us on our journey. This was my first time buying a home and Bern tolerated my plethora of questions with grace. Our first three offers were not accepted, but we stuck with it and on our fourth offer we were accepted. Throughout the process Bern demonstrated empathy, humor, and expertise. I am grateful we found Bern, he was an excellent guide and advocate on our home buying journey. If you are looking to buy real estate in San Diego county and need an agent Bern should be at the top of your list. read more

Fantastic realtor We found out about Bern while watching his Youtube videos which were really helpful especially if you are looking for a house in a city that you haven't lived before. Once we met in person, he was very friendly, helpful, proactive and answered every question we had, replied text and emails all the time and arranged everything according to our needs. We highly recommend him as your first-time homebuyer realtor because he is very knowledgeable about areas in San Diego, makes the process very easy and he is great with negotiations. read more

Working with Bern made selling my home a stress free and wonderful experience. Not only does he know real estate, he is comfortable and easy to work with. He is always there working for you. I was selling my condo that needed some work before putting on the market. He took care of everything. Made my condo Market ready. Absolutely beautiful! Sold my condo a little over asking price. Bern is a hard worker and a wonderful person. I recommend Bern to anyone selling their home or looking to buy one. Karen read more

Cannot believe that buying and selling real estate could feel so effortless... and rewarding. As a seller, Bern made sure that we were able to achieve our asking price (and then some extra). He set the stage perfectly for showing, paired with expert marketing, photos, and the use of new age technology to attract multiple buyers. He also walked us through the pros and cons of each offer we received to help us get the most out of our property. As a buyer, he helped us see dozens of properties without any issues, went around our schedule flexibly, and discussed the details thoroughly about each property we were considering. Then, as we made the offer, he acted as the perfect intermediary by being the go-between for us and had the difficult conversations on our behalf. We couldn't have asked for a better partner during the buying/selling process. Bern actually cared more about our interests and our happiness over any commission he may have earned. I couldn't imagine having a better experience. Thanks, Bern! read more

Bern helped us find our perfect home. We were moving from Texas to San Diego and did not know much about the Carmel Valley area. Bern was not only very knowledgeable about the housing in the area but also generally about the facilities and places in the neighborhood. Bern helped us with the negotiations of the contract and gave us the right advise. He also recommended a pediatrician for our kids that worked out very well. Bern went above and beyond to help us with a smooth transition. read more

We recently brought a house with our new good friend Bern. Of course, we didn't even meet him in person until just a while ago. It's just that after watching all his humorous and informative videos about the San Diego area with Courtney and his team before we made the cross country move and after actually meeting up with him in person a few times, he makes you feel that you are part of the "Off the 56" family and he will find you the perfect place! He is super easy to look at houses with and doesn't push you to make any decisions. He really enjoys his work and it shows! He was also super helpful after the sale arranging and coordinating the work that needed to be done while we were still long distance. He definitely went above and beyond! We still like to watch his videos to keep in touch with what's going on locally. I mean who doesn't want to know about the newest best donut place! We highly recommend Bern and his team!! read more

My wife and I recently moved to the San Diego area in order to be closer to our kids, and grandkids, and after more than ten months of searching with four different agents , we went to Bern. We knew that Bern was especial when we went to interview him, and unlike other agents who had asked us to sign an exclusivity contract for 6 months or longer, Bern told us that if any time we were not happy with his services we were welcome to "fire" him! After working only a few days with Bern, I realized that he is very methodical and always learning about the pulse of the real estate in different geographical areas and times. He has the rare quality of being very patient and at the same time being extremely knowledgeable and detailed oriented. Bern is also very low-key and likable. These qualities made him very effective during the negotiations to purchase our "dream home". There were four other offers, but because his amiable relationship with both the seller and his realtor, they ended up choosing our offer! If you are looking to buy or sell your home, do yourself a favor and hire Bern, he the BEST! read more

Bern was our real estate agent during our first home purchase(or in this case, condo) 3 weeks ago in Brentwood. We chanced upon him while casually searching in Marina del Rey. He never fails to impress. Seriously. I can't say enough good things. We were completely clueless as to what the escrow process entailed, red flags to look for in HOA contacts, etc. Bern clued us in with all the information we needed and it always felt like he had our best interest in mind. Bern is honest, never pushy, and just all around genuine. If you ever need help or explanations, he's always patient and available. Honestly, I'm running out adjectives to describe his awesomeness. If being nice isn't enough, he's also incredibly organized and always punctual. He would bring a binder for us to keep with a spec sheet for every listing, with an area for notes. He made us feel like we were his only clients. He emailed us listings on a daily basis based on the location and personal preferences you provide so when that perfect listing comes along you can be the first to see it and even put in an offer. After a few open housing excursions, Bern will quickly learn what you love and hate so you don't waste time at places you know you won't like. My wife and I love Bern and will undoubtedly be using him when we're ready to upgrade! read more

Bern is an absolute godsend! I can't recommend him highly enough. He held our hand through the whole process of buying our first home, and was always available to us for questions, doubts, stresses, excitement...all of it. He is not someone who will try to sell you something you don't want or can't afford. He is always honest and will give you the straight story on any situation. And on top of it all, he's a lovely person to spend your time with while stuck in Los Angeles traffic between open houses. read more

What can I say about this guy that hasn't already been said in the other glowing reviews? Bern is a fantastic realtor, and my family and I had an extremely wonderful experience with him. We were interested in buying a condo in the Brentwood/Santa Monica area, and within a day of reaching out to Bern, he had sent us a dozen or more listings and set up appointments and put together an itinerary to view a handful of properties. After a few days of home tours and getting an understanding of the market from Bern, we had come to the realization that we weren't ready to purchase just yet. We felt guilty of course, like we had in some sense wasted Bern's time. Bern however did not at all feel that way. He actually thanked US for the opportunity to work together and asked that we get in touch with him if and when we decided we were ready to purchase, and I can say definitively that we certainly will. To that affect, Bern's sincere personality (which is of course crucial in finding a good realtor) made him a delight to spend time with, and made it immediately easy to trust in him. He's young, hardworking and upbeat. His enthusiasm is infectious. Nothing about the man felt artificial or disingenuous; he simply wanted to find us the ideal place that would best meet our needs, and worked tirelessly to do so. I have no doubt that when the time comes when I am ready to purchase real estate, he'll be able to find me that dream property, with a smile. read more

We just closed escrow on our first home and are so grateful that Bern was our agent! He lead us through the whole home buying process with a genuine desire to find us a home that we would love. He always encouraged us to ask questions and was an excellent communicator with us and our seller's agent. He was prompt, professional, down-to-earth, knowledgeable, and is just an all-around great agent and person. Highly highly recommend him! read more

As a fan of nineties film nostalgia, I was instantly drawn to Bern's signage, "Spend your weekend with Bernie!" I told my wife we definitely had to add him to our list of interviews. Not as big a fan of Andrew McCarthy movies, she reluctantly agreed. However, after we met with Bern we both knew right away he was the realtor for us. We were drawn to his sincerity and professionalism. We met with a few other people who just seemed too flashy and quite frankly, arrogant. We both got the sense that Bern would truly work with us and our budget. This was our first home, so I was admittedly a little terrified. But Bern always alleviated any stresses I had. I must have emailed him a million questions throughout the process, and Bern answered every single one of them. He was always quick to respond, and we really felt like he put us first. When we found the home we knew was meant for us, Bern really guided us through. With his help, we wrote a beautiful letter to the sellers, selling our family to them. I still don't know how it happened, we were up against several cash offers, but ours was accepted! I suspect it's because people like working with him. When it was all said and done, I felt like we had made a lifelong friendship. I couldn't imagine going through that process without him. read more

I did not end up purchasing a property with Bern, but his level of service was impeccable. He knew from the beginning that I may not be able to purchase immediately, but took the time to explain the process and even show me a few properties. The learning process became far less intimidating, and I will be calling Bern when the time is right for me to buy. read more

I actually work with Bern on a professional level and can't say enough good things. We have gone from associates to good mates. Bern is an all round good guy and a heck of a realtor as well. I work with about 80 other realtors and I can tell the good from the bad and Bern sits at the top. read more

We finally closed escrow on our first house and we couldn't have done it without Bern! My husband and I are so lucky to have met Bern while house hunting on the Westside. Our first impression of him was great-not cheesy or pushy like many of the other real estate agents we've met. And as our homebuying journey progressed, our first impression was validated twofold--he's just a downright honest, likable, trustworthy guy. Bern was very conscious of staying within our price range and paid close attention to the qualities we were looking for in our first home. He gave us honest feedback about the units we toured and their neighborhoods and showed us the utmost patience during the several months it took us to find the perfect place. He would send us listings of properties on a weekly, sometimes daily basis, to make sure we didn't miss any opportunities. And when we found properties we were interested in, Bern gave us private showings with enthusiasm and without pushiness. When we finally found our dream home, Bern helped us close the deal. There were 5 other offers on our property, two of them cash deals. We were nervous, but with Bern's guidance and thoughtful presentation to the seller, they accepted OUR offer! Overall he is professional, organized and willing to go above and beyond to satisfy his clients. He is a realtor with true integrity and it is no wonder why he has loyal clients and such good rapport with other people in the field. Not only have my husband and I found our go-to real estate agent, we've also made a friend! When we are ready to upgrade to our next property, we will surely be contacting Bern! read more

My house was in Los Feliz and I interviewed several candidates for the listing. Some were old timers in the neighborhood, others had sold houses in the area and Bern. He was not from the area, with his office on the westside, but his non-flashy super professionalism and, from my point of view, his ethical zeal moved him to the top of the list. How many ways can I describe my total satisfaction with his consummate professionalism and service. From providing the most accurate estimate of the selling price of the house, to his utter willingness to be available in every way, I cannot recommend him highly enough. What was particularly outstanding was his efforts on matters that I did not suspect would arise. It is one thing to do the anticipated services, but to time and time again respond to the unexpected was remarkable. These comments are in no way meant to denigrate his services in relation to the sale. At his own expense he provided a stager to recommend articles to remove from the house and to add specific pieces as necessary. The photographer chosen specializes in homes going for 10 times our listing price. The video made included a drone, shots from the neighborhood as well as a wonderful walk through. These steps, together with the initial asking price (a number I insisted on as his valuation was more than any 2 bedroom house in the area had ever gone for by a good margin), resulted in over 200 visitors for the brokers open house, over 100 more for the weekend viewing and another 40 on the next Tuesday, and a staggering 18 offers, 17 over asking. He advised rejecting the highest offer which was more than 100k over asking but subject to a 24 hour limit. Friends and relatives were agog over the rejection, but best and final offers went up another 58k. Talk about knowing the market! During the inspection period, while I was overseas, he kept me fully apprised of all developments through texts, emails and FaceTime. His services were so outstanding I voluntarily increased his fee by 1/4 percent. If you are considering using the services of Bern McGovern, do yourself a favor and hire him! read more

Bern is a long-term relationship professional who is not looking for a quick transaction. More than once he directed us away from properties that would not have been suitable. He's easy to talk to, has knowledge of the area, and has a wealth of post-transaction vendors at his disposal. read more

Just closed yesterday on a condo sale with Bern and I cannot say enough about his skills, his service and willingness to do what it takes to get the maximum value from a home sale. I interviewed several agents and stumbled upon Bern on Yelp. What I liked about Bern as that he's down to earth and comfortable to deal with and clearly skilled at the modern art of marketing a property. The greatest part of my sale, was that Bern recommended a sales price substantially higher than the other agents I talked to and then even more amazing, we got that price. Most agents look at just "closed" transactions but he poked around and found a pending unit not yet closed, pending at a much higher price than other comps and used that "comp" to justify a record price for similar units in the project. Bern is truly full service. He supplied awesome vendors to do needed rehab on the place at great prices pre-listing and literally drove to my office 4 or 5 times to pick up paperwork or facilitate signing docs, etc that truly made this thing a breeze. I had total confidence in letting him handle it and when a decision would arise he would explain both sides but would support any call I made. Always a text away, I now personally know why Bern gets the glowing reviews that he does. I highly recommend him for any sale or purchase. Go Bern! read more

Thorough, Attentive and Pleasant to work with, not to mention his love and extensive knowledge of the Real Estate experience. From start to finish to include the negotiations. The one thing that most stands out is Bern is very responsive that aided in our decision to purchase. Moved from the Washington DC Metro area to San Diego with a seamless transition. We were able to purchase the house that we love. You cannot go wrong with Bern McGovern. Thank You again, Bern. read more

Best realtor ever (and now friend)! He went above and beyond during and even after the sale. I still go to him for questions on home warranty and etc, and he is always happy and prompt to help. The selling agent even told us that one of the main reasons for the Sellers selecting us was because of Bern's presentation (pretty darn impressive; a must see) and personality. Thank you x 3~~~~ read more

My wife and I had the unfortunate advantage of having worked with another realtor for a while, so when we met Bern and began working with him, we were able to see just how extraordinary he was. As first time home buyers, we had a million questions, and Bern was happy to answer every single one, or do the legwork until he found the answer. He is amazingly prompt with his email and phone responses, which, when you are racing to get a form filled out or submitted by the end of a business day, is a LIFE SAVER! Bern takes a personal interest in your home buying (or selling) process: he was here with us for inspections, giving his thoughts and recommendations, both as a realtor and as a friend (i.e. if he thinks something is overpriced or fishy, he'll tell you). He also manages relationships and personalities really well, so dealing with other realtors, sellers, mortgage brokers etc. became 10 times easier with him mediating. I cannot recommend him enough (and already have, to ALL of our friends). When the times come for our next home, there is no question we will use Bern again. read more

Hands down, Bern is one of the best realtors around. He knows the real estate business inside out, and he helped my husband and I immensely when we purchased our first home back in September. Bern is always reachable, and is consistently on top of every little detail. The best part is that on top of all of his skills, he also happens to be an absolutely lovely person. Buying a home can be a bit of a roller coaster experience, but having Bern explain everything every step of the way, and knowing that he always was on our side made it a piece of cake. I can't recommend him enough!! read more

Bern worked with me to sell my condo and I can not sing higher praises. He helped me with the tenant move-out, a water leak, repairs, and got me a great price quickly - all without me having to set foot in San Diego (I moved out of the area). He is very professional, responsive, and informative, and truly a pleasure to work with. I would definitely work with him again given the opportunity. read more

Bern was great. No pressure, very responsive to emails and calls. Made us feel extremely comfortable throughout the whole process.He stuck with us through the approximately nine months of looking and submitting several offers. He never gave up on us, and in the end, we truly ended up with the best place to call our home that we could have. Thanks Bern! read more

I met Bern thru a mutual friend shortly before entering the home buying experience for the first time. After bending his ear and picking his brain for a while, he gave me his number and told me to call if I ever needed anything. Thing is, he was aware that we were doing a "non-agent" deal with our property owner. Says a lot about him that he was genuine in offering any assistance or advice we needed. He made a site visit and offered his professional opinion, offered to mediate so that both sides got what they wanted and was always available for my stupid questions. Bern is truly knowledgeable, genuine and available. Should we ever buy another home - I surely would use his services and I suggest you do the same. THANKS AGAIN BERN! read more

Bern was awesome! Not only was Bern a true professional, but super friendly to work with as well. He was always on time, prompt in his responses and made a first time home buyer like me very at ease during the entire process. As a result, I am typing this review from my dream home =) and I could not be happier! I would highly recommend using Bern to find your next home! read more

My wife and I have worked with Bern twice now over the past 2 years, once to sell our condo in westwood and once to buy a house in encino. In both cases he exceeded our expectations. Selling: We met with a few agents to determine the best strategy to sell our place quickly (we just had a baby) and get the most money possible. Every other agent came to the table with a cookie cutter strategy that didn't feel custom at all. Then we met Bern.. He came to the table with the best strategy ever - with an actual buyer.. We closed quickly and without headache. Most agents will say they have someone looking for a similar property, but Bern actually came through. Buying: After entering escrow on our condo we sent Bern on a mission - find us an amazing house under budget and in a very small area of interest. He did just that, and quickly. We looked at a handful of houses and decided to put an offer that was contingent on the sale going through on our place. After several rounds of negotiations he came back and said they accepted.. This was during the summer months when places in the area were going for over asking price and with limited contingencies. We didn't think we had a chance but he came through... Long story short, whether you're selling or buying a place Bern is a true professional. He's always a call away and never gives you the run around. I would recommend his services to anyone.. read more

We were super lucky and grateful to have found Bern. I've heard horror stories about real estate agents so I was very careful in selecting an agent when I was ready to look for a house. I met with a few agents but when I met Bern, I knew he was the one for us. He came polished, on time, and prepared. He was professional but easy going at the same time. Most importantly he is honest and genuine. He didn't try to sway us to buy a certain house, nor push us into something we didn't want to do. When asked, he would provide his opinion based on his research and knowledge of the current market. He was objective in his responses. We didn't think it would take us 6 months to find our perfect home but it did! Bern was present and checked in throughout the lulls of house hunting to let us know he is still actively searching for us. Bern is quick in responding to emails and phone calls and his turnaround time to answer questions is about 24 hours if he needed to reach the listing agent. Being a first time homeowner, I needed an agent that was patient and explained to me every step of the process. Bern did that very thing. Transparency is hard sometimes when there are so many moving parts when buying a home i.e. lender, mortgage broker, listing agent, buyer but Bern made the process as smooth and clear as it possibly could have been. I am definitely recommending Bern to all my friends and family. read more

We recently purchased a home and we are extremely thankful that we chose Bern as our realtor. His knowledge and attention to detail is unmatched which sets him apart from the rest. He made the entire process smooth and effortless. He was patient, understanding, and always ensured we felt comfortable with any decisions that were made. He helped us in every aspect of the journey. From finding the home we always wanted, the loan process, and escrow process, Bern was there every step of the way. He kept us informed and scheduled everything we needed. He answered all of the questions we had and always kept our best interest at the forefront. We couldn't have asked for a better experience. Thank you for everything Bern! read more

Working with Bern made our entire house hunting process so much better that I struggle to describe it in words. We spent about six months working with Bern to find our home, and during that time he was always available, responsive and professional. At no point did we feel like we were "just another client" or that he was too busy with other clients to help us. His knowledge of the LA market is incredibly detailed, and he had more than a few brilliant strategies that enabled us to get our perfect home for an incredible price (for us). The bottom line is that choosing to work with Bern is not a decision you will regret, and I can't recommend him highly enough. read more

My husband and I were renting in Claremont and were getting ready to buy but we were casting a wide net on where we wanted to live. We bounced between Rancho Penasquitos to Carlsbad to Scripps Ranch. On top of that we couldn't decide if we wanted a "turn-key" home or a fixer-upper. So in short Bern had to narrow our results down from EVERY POSSIBLE HOUSE IN SAN DIEGO COUNTY. And he stayed in stride with our ever changing minds. I had received several referrals for real estate agents due to my job and we had interviewed quite a few agents that range from leaders in the San Diego front to friends-of-friends. In the end we stayed with Bern not only because of his calm yet confident nature, but also because he was not showy. We did not want a car salesman, we wanted someone on our team that we could trust to fight for us and also help us with the leg work. Due to our work schedules, we couldn't always go see a property and my husband and I RARELY got to go to a property together so Bern had to accommodate for both circumstances. He had to deal with taking us individually to the same house, but at the same time, deal with both of our VERY DIFFERENT input (every house I liked, my husband didn't and vice versa... you can see how frustrating this was). Bern focused his efforts on both of our needs to narrowed down our choices from there. Once we decided on a house, we ran into normal, but frustrating hiccups with: the house, the seller, the loan broker, the renovations etc and Bern did not walk away after the final signing, he continued to work to help us with laying out our plans for renovating the house. We are so thankful we chose Bern and he did not give up on us. Fortunately for us we gained a good friend as well. I HIGHLY recommend using Bern for any of your property needs. read more

Bern was such a big help to us on our move from the East coast. He is extremely knowledgeable about the area and helped us to narrow down a location to look for our new home in San Diego. He was very patient, taking us around to many different areas/homes and answering all of our numerous questions. Bern is also familiar with East coast real estate and was able to guide us on some of the differences on what we would find in CA. Since we landed on a new construction home, Bern also helped us find temporary housing in the school district we needed to be in while we waited for our home to be built. During the entire process, he stayed in touch to make sure everything was going smoothly. Not only is Bern a great realtor but also a great guy - friendly, professional and a great resource for information. We highly recommend him to anyone needing the best realtor! read more

Bern deserves 6 stars! We went through a selection process to pick an agent who understood the market and could sell our home quickly but with top market price. We knew we were asking for a lot but Bern was more than the right choice! He delivered on all 3, plus so much more. Since we were moving to Texas we needed lots of help on many items. Besides navigating through the real estate processes, he helped ensure we had what we needed on the many other duties we needed to perform. Bern is exceptional with the use of technology. He produced a video that was so good we almost thought we should stay in the home! We got instant, and significant, interest in the house. Importantly, we got good advice from Bern on setting the price. And most importantly we got a great offer. And we got it in "record time". I commend Bern also because he is trustworthy and always responsive. Simply put, he's a 6-star! read more

We worked with Bern as our realtor to sell our house and we have only great things about to say about his services. He is super easy to work with, knows the North County San Diego real estate market very well, schedules all events and coordinates with all contractors seamlessly with you (repairs, inspections, MLS posting, open house(s), rent backs, etc.) until closing. He is able to adjust as things evolve, has good contacts with contractors to complete upgrades/repairs, helps with staging, creates beautiful and professional marketing information (flyers, awesome short video), does a thoughtful and well informed review of the offers to assess pros/cons, and coordinates everything promptly. He made the process super smooth for us while we had busy work schedules, had young kids to handle, and were closing in the middle of coronavirus lockdown. Bern constantly went above and beyond. He will do whatever it takes to get the job done and in professional and down to earth way. We highly recommend him. read more

Simply put, Bern is the first real estate agent my wife and I ever worked with and will be our last. He did a wonderful job walking us novices through the home buying process, which can be complicated and downright scary when you're a noob. He's professional, unassuming and lacks the ego of your typical LA real estate agent. Despite being an Eagles fan, he's a good guy and you should go with him too. read more

We met Bern at the beginning of what turned out to be a 6 month home buying process. Through it all, Bern was extremely helpful, proactive and supportive as we looked at maybe 35-40+ properties in search of the place we wanted. He patiently arranged appointments, met us at open houses, answered calls/texts at all times of the day and much more. I highly recommend using Bern for a friendly and active home buying process. read more